“Children mix almost all the time. They don’t care where someone is from”
And interview with a nursery teacher in Germany
Karin Grätzer is a very passionate nursery teacher in Germany with 20 years of experience. Her interest in pedagogy and psychology, which she studied and graduated from as a certified social pedagogue, lead her to work in a kindergarten where she uses her creativity and engagement to innovate and improve the daily life of co-workers and children. One of her innovations has been a voting system for children where they can now annually pin their pictures next to their favorite nursery teachers in a big event to vote with a primary and a secondary vote in which group they would like to be in that year. This system is a special for her facility as children are normally just placed into groups without being asked.
Karin Grätzer (right) building small houses with the children and their parents // Frankfuter Neue Presse
Q: Would you say that the job changed a lot during the past years? Or since you started as kindergartner?
A: Yes. Amongst other things there is a lot of observing and documenting nowadays to be able to support each child in their own individual learning. There are also no longer set group-rooms but rather learn areas with specific equipment like an acting room, a crafting room, an art room, etc. The attitude towards children greatly improved in terms of their individuality and personality. But there are also less German native speakers within the specialized personnel… which could be caused by the underpayment. (She wonders). With us are 5 native speakers. Others come from Spain, Poland, Bulgaria, Ukraine, Turkey and Africa. Some don’t have a high enough German level to be a role model for the children. What also changed are the clients, the migration background is about 98% in our facility. Parents often don’t speak much German or none at all which makes it hard to communicate and our parent information’s are often not well understood. Children often join us without being able to speak a German word.
Q: How do you deal with children that don’t speak any German?
A: Out of our 17 to be schoolchildren, this year, 14 are taking the German-preclass to prepare for elementary school for children that are missing a lot of language knowledge. There are also language courses offered to our mid age children through extern organizations.
Q: At which age do most of the children join the kindergarten and until which age do they stay?
A: 3-6. Most children come at the age of 3. There is a German law that says that every child at the age of 3 has the right for a spot in a kindergarten. In rare cases children also join at the age of 5, these are mostly kids that recently moved, in a lot of cases without sufficient German skills or social competence. Then it depends on the employment, day care places are only available with validation.
Q: You said that the rate of kids with a migration background is very high. Are the children able to integrate themselves? Or do children with the same ethnical background rather stay among themselves or alone?
A: Children mix almost all the time; they don’t care where someone is from. There are rarely groups that share the same language and speak in their native language. The language of the nursery schools is German and it works really well.
Q: How would you handle the situation if a child would, for example, often make racist remarks? Does that happen?
A: Firstly to speak about it with child after the remark. It naturally depends on the age of the child and how well it understands. In any case a talk with the parents about that topic has to happen. Besides that we would always treat the racist remark in the same way. By recurrences with sanctions and just like with physical attacks – if it gets too much the parents would have to come and pick the child up. That is the standard procedure if the behavior is not to be tolerated and can’t be stopped.
Q: Would you say that some children are, for example, naturally more aggressive than others or can their behavior always be backtracked to their social situation?
A: Puuhhh. (She hesitates). It’s a basic question. I don’t think that every behavior is just learned. I think it is a combination out of genetic, biochemical reactions and the social background … but it is especially important how the environment reacts to it.
Q: How is your approach if some children are excluding another child?
A: Like always if something isn’t as it should be: talking with the children. Explain them how it feels like to be excluded but also ask why as the excluded children are often at least partly responsible – because they take things away from others or always want to be in charge. It is also important to talk to the excluded child, talk about different behaviors but also communicate that it is okay if someone or a group doesn’t want to play with you.
Q: How important do you think it is for a child to go to kindergarten? As some children stay at home being cared by their parents or one of their parents.
A: I think it is very important – especially for the social contact and the social competence as well as for learning about differentness. For not native speakers it is naturally extremely important for their German practice. But … not all kindergartens are as good as ours. (She laughs). There are always some reports from parents whose children are unhappy because of a bad attitude from nursery teachers. It is just unfortunate for the child if it is in day care the whole day and the parent spend almost no time with the child. Then I think there is something missing.
Q: Are there conflicts between nursery teachers in terms of educational questions?
A: Calling it conflicts might be too much. Rather discussions. A big part of that is surely the personal experience. Difficult questions are discussed with the whole team and a decision will be made if needed.
Q: Would you say that there are educational differences between the education and care of boys and girls?
A: Hmm. (She pauses). I think yes. But not generally. Rather that you use “girly lego” to attract girls into the crafting room and that you are especially happy if a girl plays football. Maybe boys are getting scolded more if they hit a girl. Yes, I think overall girls are a bit more supported. But boys are also allowed to wear dresses, to walk around in heels, to play with barbies and to cook in the kids kitchen…
Q: Would you say that children already join kindergarten with the “this is typical boy, this is typical girl” attitude?
A: That varies a lot – I think it’s half/half. Many are very open. But many also know exactly which colors are girl-colors and laugh if someone dresses up or they don’t want to play with girls. One time we had a boy who was looking forward to waffles at lunch all day long but when he saw that the waffles had a heart shape he was shocked and refused to eat them. But he was already 6 years old and that was really extreme.
Q: There are generally way more women working in kindergartens than men, why do you think that is?
A: More interest and the relation between woman and children but also the bad payment, the lack of acknowledgement, it being a typical women’s job and the missing career chances. I think that men are generally caring more about their salary and their career than women – but that might just be a prejudice.
Q: Would you welcome it if the job would be more evenly balanced between men and women?
A: Yes! I think the more diverse the nursery teachers are the better as long as they all share the same fundamental attitude.
Q: Better for the education of the children?
A: Yes of course! I think men are different in a way. They might react differently or have a deeper louder voice and they partly have different competences. Many children don’t experience their fathers that much at home as many work till evening and on Saturdays or because their mother is a single parent. In the kindergarten they also mostly experience grown women and it’s similar in elementary school. Yes, I think there is something missing. Maybe the boys are just missing a same gender role model. Oh, apropos a man recently started working as a nursery teacher in our faculty.
Q: Would you want to say or add anything else?
A: A lot of what you learned and what is good and right can’t be properly applied. Even through the current understaffing we try as well as we can but the reality is that you are just too stressed during the daily routine which means that you often have to cut short on your methods and ideals. It’s unfortunate as exactly those are so very important.
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